I am quite ambivalent about the Joker movie, so don't expect a glowing review from me. First, let me say that Joaquin Phoenix's performance is unimpeachable. And sure, the picture's look is strong, with Gotham City being played by a well-reproduced 1970s New York. But I have two problems with the flick, and they bothered me well beyond the 2-hour experience. First is how derivative it is. Todd Phillips' hard-on for 70s cinema is obvious, and at his most clever, he uses the Exorcist stairs to evoke something (well, almost, we'll get to that), but otherwise, as everyone's said, he's doing Scorsese (in particular Taxi Driver and The King of Comedy), but also Fight Club, Frank Miller (ugh, can't we get away from Year One's specifics even once in these movies?), and a couple seasons of Gotham. In fact, I often felt like this was just a Gotham episode writ large. The other more important problem is that Joker pretends to have a message, or messages, but it's really not about anything (so the very meaning of the word "pretentious"). It never closes the deal on anything it might have to say. It's not really about we treat the mentally ill, because it's ultimately a cartoonish and negative portrayal of mental illness. It's not really about the making of a serial killer, as it's so keen on Joker staying sympathetic, it avoids any real shock to the audience's system (and does a hit job on the Waynes so he can never ever stop being a victim no matter what). It's not about how we should be kinder to one another and punch up rather than down, because the film itself makes fun of a minority character in a "punch-down" kind of way, a darkly comic moment that is sadly one of the only moments of comedy in the film. Because it's not a comedy, not even a dark one, and Joker's line about his life that's in the trailer comes out of left field and isn't earned. It's not even really a subversive Joker origin story, chickening out of its twist connection between Joker and the eventual Batman (then still polluting Batman's origin story by not understanding the power of its simplicity as part of a by-that-time interminable coda because WE NEED THAT MONEY SHOT! No we don't). Hey, I would probably have criticized that too, but at least it would have meant Joker completed a pass on SOMEthing. I think the film is actually summed up in the preachy but confused scene where Joker denies twice that he's not political and doesn't care about anything, as bookends to a sermon that's entirely political. I kept waiting for the movie to decide what it was about, but it isn't about anything but itself as a product (look at me! I'm a serious alternative to MCU-type, four-color action comedies!). Whatever dude, I'm not buying it.
Joaquin Phoenix turns in a stellar performance, several interesting themes are explored, and there are quite a few plot twists in the middle of the film. It is a sophisticated picture, but not an especially deep one. The movie is oddly hesitant to commit itself to its own themes. At times the message seems to be that rich people are evil and capitalism is to blame for all of society's problems. At other times it is critical of mob rule and casts Joker as a dangerous anarchist sowing destruction and misery. I think the attempt was to make Joker a nuanced character and make it difficult to say for sure whether he's a hero, villain, or victim. But pulling off such subtly takes extreme writing talent, which is just not present here. The end result is a film that contradicts itself and says little of substance. It is still worth a watch though, because as a character study it is excellent. As a critique of any major issue, it fails.
ok i don't know what some of the people commenting here expected or watched. someone calls it a failure as a ""batman"" movie. wut? someone says it fails to say anything about capitalism?? HUH???
spoilers it's about a man's descent into madness but portrayed beautifully as someone whom society, people, life and loved ones failed miserably and how someone who was already cracked completely broke down and became a product of their circumstances.
INCREDIBLY depressing and deeply moving, the film executed the theme it wanted excellently. it's not about capitalism or the evils of it, it's not about society, it's about how someone could very realistically be so crushed by the weight of their circumstances that once they see life as endless misery, it turns into a comedy of errors
Probably one of the best portrayals of mental illness I’ve ever seen. Not to be treated as a Batman film or you’ll struggle to enjoy it. Gripping from start to finish and you sympathise with the antagonist-one of the top films of 2019.
Not being much of a superhero fan, I found this film surprisingly deep and inspiring. It doesn't go as deep as it could have into a proper critique of the system, but the hints are there, and I found many dynamics of these thematic elements to be surprisingly realistic.
For example, I absolutely loved how the "clown" movement wasn't actually born from Arthur's first murders, which if anything were little more than self-defense, but from Thomas Wayne's classist remark on how people how dislike the rich are nothing but "envious clowns".
But more than anything, it's simply a man's descent into madness, as each of his hopes and points of support betrays him, and finds the hilarity he's always wanted to feel and inspire into chaos and vengeance.
Having seen most Batman movies and Arkham games, i always considered Batman nothing more than sociopathic, spoiled rich guy with delusions of grandeur, who acts as an above-the-law vigilante by only acting against small street crime because that is what took his parents from him, for nothing but a desire for vengeance, hiding behind an hypocritical and fake sense of superior morality just because he "doesn't kill" (usually); all the while doing nothing to combat corruption, white collar crime or the other causes that make Gotham the dirty, unjustifiable hellhole of inequality that it is, becoming the personification of bourgeis power fantasy, the Silent Protector of the Status Quo. In other words, he is just the same as the Joker, he simply had the luck of being born healthy and into a rich family rather than into the working class.
Watching this movie was a bit like listening to a joke where you're expecting a satisfying punchline except it never quite shows up. Phoenix does a great job, and like many have said, his performance is downright incredible. Going into it, if I knew nothing of Batman and all of DC comics, I wouldn't know this was based on a comic book movie at all. Todd Phillips sets out to make a realistic movie devoid of anything that makes a superhero movie, and I think he succeeds in that regard.
One thing that really weighs down the film I think is its attempt to be very modern with its whole "take down the rich" narrative. It never fully materializes and so it gets muddled with the sheer amount of other themes presented. It seems almost odd to say but in this alternate universe I guess Bats would essentially be the bad guy. I mean he's rich, and that means he's included in the sweep of charged animosity in the film, and he's also anti-criminal so it's a double whammy. Not sure if that is particularly what the creators had in mind but you certainly can't sweep the implications of the mob's motives and theme of the movie under the rug like that. Can't have the cake and eat it too.
Very interesting that in The Dark Knight, the theme of the movie is the Joker attempting to pull everyone down to his level. Yet in the end his attempts fail because he's wrong about human nature. In this movie it's quite the opposite, the Joker becomes the catalyst that brings out the evil within men's hearts, and they surrender to it.
Overall it's a decent movie, very dark. I think it could have been much better though if it picked a core theme and ran with it rather than being almost a series of vignettes. Curious how this was touted as an "origin story" when it's just a one-off movie in a different DC universe. So... yeah it's an origin story, but has nothing to do with any other Joker or Batman movies we've seen thus far. The reasoning for why the movie exists at all is rather odd.
Oh dear.. who went to see this thinking it was a superhero movie.?! smh No DC superheroes were used in the making of this film.
Joaquin Phoenix is outstanding as the mentally ill Arthur Fleck, whose descent into madness is both depressing and hauntingly beautiful. A stunning film, one to be seen again.
Don't love this movie. I don't even actually like it all that much. I love Joaquin's performance as Joker and all the things that he does are great and really pull you into his situation, however, it's the overall storyline that loses me. Nothing in the story that happens is all that believable to me, and that makes me not want to get invested in the world, so the events of the movie just end up boring me and makes me not want to continue watching.
I was afraid the hype was gonna kill it for me but it was absolutely brilliant. Amazing performance from Phoenix and brilliantly put together. Mixing Chaplin with Noir is no mean feat, but this movie pulls it off
Feels like after this you need to go and watch your Hitchock and Tati movies.
There are interesting points anyway like Joker character and the thin line between reality, madness and dreams.
It is a good movie allthought it is not a masterpiece
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Comments 1 - 15 of 42
hugeposuer
A man finds meaning in life through his love for dance.Siskoid
I am quite ambivalent about the Joker movie, so don't expect a glowing review from me. First, let me say that Joaquin Phoenix's performance is unimpeachable. And sure, the picture's look is strong, with Gotham City being played by a well-reproduced 1970s New York. But I have two problems with the flick, and they bothered me well beyond the 2-hour experience. First is how derivative it is. Todd Phillips' hard-on for 70s cinema is obvious, and at his most clever, he uses the Exorcist stairs to evoke something (well, almost, we'll get to that), but otherwise, as everyone's said, he's doing Scorsese (in particular Taxi Driver and The King of Comedy), but also Fight Club, Frank Miller (ugh, can't we get away from Year One's specifics even once in these movies?), and a couple seasons of Gotham. In fact, I often felt like this was just a Gotham episode writ large. The other more important problem is that Joker pretends to have a message, or messages, but it's really not about anything (so the very meaning of the word "pretentious"). It never closes the deal on anything it might have to say. It's not really about we treat the mentally ill, because it's ultimately a cartoonish and negative portrayal of mental illness. It's not really about the making of a serial killer, as it's so keen on Joker staying sympathetic, it avoids any real shock to the audience's system (and does a hit job on the Waynes so he can never ever stop being a victim no matter what). It's not about how we should be kinder to one another and punch up rather than down, because the film itself makes fun of a minority character in a "punch-down" kind of way, a darkly comic moment that is sadly one of the only moments of comedy in the film. Because it's not a comedy, not even a dark one, and Joker's line about his life that's in the trailer comes out of left field and isn't earned. It's not even really a subversive Joker origin story, chickening out of its twist connection between Joker and the eventual Batman (then still polluting Batman's origin story by not understanding the power of its simplicity as part of a by-that-time interminable coda because WE NEED THAT MONEY SHOT! No we don't). Hey, I would probably have criticized that too, but at least it would have meant Joker completed a pass on SOMEthing. I think the film is actually summed up in the preachy but confused scene where Joker denies twice that he's not political and doesn't care about anything, as bookends to a sermon that's entirely political. I kept waiting for the movie to decide what it was about, but it isn't about anything but itself as a product (look at me! I'm a serious alternative to MCU-type, four-color action comedies!). Whatever dude, I'm not buying it.Paravail
It was...okay.Joaquin Phoenix turns in a stellar performance, several interesting themes are explored, and there are quite a few plot twists in the middle of the film. It is a sophisticated picture, but not an especially deep one. The movie is oddly hesitant to commit itself to its own themes. At times the message seems to be that rich people are evil and capitalism is to blame for all of society's problems. At other times it is critical of mob rule and casts Joker as a dangerous anarchist sowing destruction and misery. I think the attempt was to make Joker a nuanced character and make it difficult to say for sure whether he's a hero, villain, or victim. But pulling off such subtly takes extreme writing talent, which is just not present here. The end result is a film that contradicts itself and says little of substance. It is still worth a watch though, because as a character study it is excellent. As a critique of any major issue, it fails.
baraka92
“The world is shit... the world is shit... the world is shit... the world is shit...”Wait! He’s finally going to make a speech.
...of course... “THE WORLD IS SHIT”.
Not awful but I found it monotonous and derivative. It really doesn’t say much about anything. Just watch The King of Comedy and Taxi Driver.
Also, I liked Phoenix better in The Master.
aniforprez
ok i don't know what some of the people commenting here expected or watched. someone calls it a failure as a ""batman"" movie. wut? someone says it fails to say anything about capitalism?? HUH???spoilers it's about a man's descent into madness but portrayed beautifully as someone whom society, people, life and loved ones failed miserably and how someone who was already cracked completely broke down and became a product of their circumstances.
INCREDIBLY depressing and deeply moving, the film executed the theme it wanted excellently. it's not about capitalism or the evils of it, it's not about society, it's about how someone could very realistically be so crushed by the weight of their circumstances that once they see life as endless misery, it turns into a comedy of errors
9/10 this was a really horrifying watch
Pauljt1980
Probably one of the best portrayals of mental illness I’ve ever seen. Not to be treated as a Batman film or you’ll struggle to enjoy it. Gripping from start to finish and you sympathise with the antagonist-one of the top films of 2019.danisanna
Dark, grizzly and twisted. Great origin story.MordredMS
Not being much of a superhero fan, I found this film surprisingly deep and inspiring. It doesn't go as deep as it could have into a proper critique of the system, but the hints are there, and I found many dynamics of these thematic elements to be surprisingly realistic.But more than anything, it's simply a man's descent into madness, as each of his hopes and points of support betrays him, and finds the hilarity he's always wanted to feel and inspire into chaos and vengeance.
Having seen most Batman movies and Arkham games, i always considered Batman nothing more than sociopathic, spoiled rich guy with delusions of grandeur, who acts as an above-the-law vigilante by only acting against small street crime because that is what took his parents from him, for nothing but a desire for vengeance, hiding behind an hypocritical and fake sense of superior morality just because he "doesn't kill" (usually); all the while doing nothing to combat corruption, white collar crime or the other causes that make Gotham the dirty, unjustifiable hellhole of inequality that it is, becoming the personification of bourgeis power fantasy, the Silent Protector of the Status Quo. In other words, he is just the same as the Joker, he simply had the luck of being born healthy and into a rich family rather than into the working class.
Well, this film finally agrees with me.
DisneyStitch
Watching this movie was a bit like listening to a joke where you're expecting a satisfying punchline except it never quite shows up. Phoenix does a great job, and like many have said, his performance is downright incredible. Going into it, if I knew nothing of Batman and all of DC comics, I wouldn't know this was based on a comic book movie at all. Todd Phillips sets out to make a realistic movie devoid of anything that makes a superhero movie, and I think he succeeds in that regard.One thing that really weighs down the film I think is its attempt to be very modern with its whole "take down the rich" narrative. It never fully materializes and so it gets muddled with the sheer amount of other themes presented. It seems almost odd to say but in this alternate universe I guess Bats would essentially be the bad guy. I mean he's rich, and that means he's included in the sweep of charged animosity in the film, and he's also anti-criminal so it's a double whammy. Not sure if that is particularly what the creators had in mind but you certainly can't sweep the implications of the mob's motives and theme of the movie under the rug like that. Can't have the cake and eat it too.
Very interesting that in The Dark Knight, the theme of the movie is the Joker attempting to pull everyone down to his level. Yet in the end his attempts fail because he's wrong about human nature. In this movie it's quite the opposite, the Joker becomes the catalyst that brings out the evil within men's hearts, and they surrender to it.
Overall it's a decent movie, very dark. I think it could have been much better though if it picked a core theme and ran with it rather than being almost a series of vignettes. Curious how this was touted as an "origin story" when it's just a one-off movie in a different DC universe. So... yeah it's an origin story, but has nothing to do with any other Joker or Batman movies we've seen thus far. The reasoning for why the movie exists at all is rather odd.
TheOnlyRogueAngel
Oh dear.. who went to see this thinking it was a superhero movie.?! smh No DC superheroes were used in the making of this film.Joaquin Phoenix is outstanding as the mentally ill Arthur Fleck, whose descent into madness is both depressing and hauntingly beautiful. A stunning film, one to be seen again.
thecr1mmreaper
Don't love this movie. I don't even actually like it all that much. I love Joaquin's performance as Joker and all the things that he does are great and really pull you into his situation, however, it's the overall storyline that loses me. Nothing in the story that happens is all that believable to me, and that makes me not want to get invested in the world, so the events of the movie just end up boring me and makes me not want to continue watching.dippygirl78
I'm not sure whether I enjoyed it or not...Typically Thomas
I was afraid the hype was gonna kill it for me but it was absolutely brilliant. Amazing performance from Phoenix and brilliantly put together. Mixing Chaplin with Noir is no mean feat, but this movie pulls it offlucafilm
Feels like after this you need to go and watch your Hitchock and Tati movies.There are interesting points anyway like Joker character and the thin line between reality, madness and dreams.
It is a good movie allthought it is not a masterpiece
Greta90
Very strong and touching movie of one man's endless misery.Showing items 1 – 15 of 42